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Vulture

Listen closer to pop music — hear how it moves us. Hosted by musicologist Nate Sloan & songwriter Charlie Harding. From Vulture and the Vox Media Podcast Network.

Switched on Pop

In June 2025, indie veterans Deerhoof scrubbed their entire catalog from the world’s dominant streaming platform. The catalyst wasn't low royalties, but Spotify co-founder Daniel Ek’s investment in AI military technology through his investment firm Prima Materia. Greg Saunier and Satomi Matsuzaki explain why they are prioritizing their ethics over exposure. They argue that the "convenience" of streaming traps us in harmful systems. They’d prefer listeners explore alternative paths to hear their music. That’s why the band premiered their latest single on Craigslist. And it’s they half jokingly say they "would rather our fans steal our music than stream our music at this point."

SONGS DISCUSSED

Deerhoof: Immigrant Song, Scarcity is Manufactured, Life is Suffering, Return of the Return of the Fire Trick Star

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Get Zach Tenorio's synth extraveganza 'Field Trip'
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Quitting Spotify (ft. Deerhoof)

This year, there were a few records that delivered less-than-optimal returns on either the Hot 100 or the Billboard 200 – and they all came from former Disney pop stars. 

Demi Lovato’s latest album peaked at number nine on the Billboard 200, where it spent one week and then fell off; Selena Gomez’s record with Benny Blanco peaked at number 2 on the Billboard 200, but no songs cracked the top 40; and Miley Cyrus’s album is her shortest charting project to date. On this episode of Switched On Pop, Nate and Reanna try to get to the bottom of the so-called “Disney curse,” and why these artists are unable to recapture their past commercial success.

Songs discussed:

 Demi Lovato – Here All Night

 Selena Gomez, benny blanco – Sunset Blvd

 Miley Cyrus – End of the World

 Demi Lovato – Sorry Not Sorry

 Demi Lovato – Heart Attack

 Demi Lovato – Skin of my Teeth

 Demi Lovato – Fast

 Kesha – JOYRIDE.

 Demi Lovato – Frequency

 Demi Lovato – Kiss

 Todd Terry, Martha Wash – Keep On Jumpin'

 Demi Lovato – Sorry To Myself

 Selena Gomez, A$AP Rocky – Good For You

 Kygo, Selena Gomez – It Ain't Me

 Selena Gomez, Marshmallo – Wolves

 Selena Gomez, benny blanco, Gracie Abrams – Call Me When You Break Up

 benny blanco, Selena Gomez, J Balvin, Tainy – I Can't Get Enough

 J Balvin, Willy William – Mi Gente

 Selena Gomez, benny blanco – Bluest Flame

 Selena Gomez, benny blanco, The Marías – Ojos Tristes

 Miley Cyrus, Big Sean – Love Money Party

 Miley Cyrus – Flowers

 Miley Cyrus – Easy Lover

 Miley Cyrus, Naomi Campbell – Every Girl You've Ever Loved

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Is there a Disney curse?: Demi, Selena, and Miley

Spanish pop star Rosalía is back with her new album, Lux. Over eighteen tracks, she trades in the dembow beats that filled her last record Motomami for maximalist orchestral sounds more in line with Björk than Bad Bunny. 

The album is dense: there's four movements, thirteen languages, arrangements by Caroline Shaw, and a wide breadth of influences – from Benedictine saints to Patti Smith. But despite (or because) all of this, Rosalía has gone on record referring to Lux as, ultimately, a pop album. 

That's where we come in. On this episode of Switched On Pop, Nate and Reanna put on their tour guide hats to talk all things Lux: its sonic genre-bending, Rosalía’s poetic lyricism, and her hyper-local flamenco influence. 

Check out Bella Freud's interview with Rosalia on Fashion Neurosis

Songs discussed:

 Rosalía – Berghain

 Rosalía – Bizcochito

 Rosalía – De Madrugá

 Rosalía – Mio Cristo

 Rosalía – La Yugular

 Björk – Joga

 Caroline Shaw, Roomful of Teeth – Partita for 8 Voices

 Rosalía – Sexo, Violencia y Llantas

 Rosalía – Divinize

 Rosalía – Porcelana

 Rosalía – Dios Es Un Stalker

 The Police – Every Breath You Take

 Rosalía – La Perla

 Johann Strauss II – The Blue Danube

 Drake – Push Ups

 Rosalía – Sauvignon Blanc

 Lady Gaga – Grigio Girls

 Adele – I Drink Wine

 Rosalía – Focu ‘Ranni

 Rosalía – Novia Robot

 Rosalía – La Rumba del Perdón

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Rosalía's 'LUX' brings the symphony to the club

They say the best revenge is living well, but if you’re a pop star going through a break up, that’s false. The best revenge is releasing a searing scorched-earth revenge banger that calls out your ex and, ideally, rides that vengeance to the top of the Billboard charts.

That’s exactly what Tate McRae and Lily Allen have done in the wake of their high profile break ups; McRae with the track “TIT FOR TAT” and Allen with an entire album, West End Girl. On this episode of Switched On Pop, Charlie and Nate use these tracks to explore the art of the revenge song.

Songs Discussed

 Tate McRae – TIT FOR TAT

 The Kid LAROI, Justin Bieber – STAY

 Angelo Badalamenti – Twin Peaks Theme

 Fleetwood Mac – Dreams

 Fleetwood Mac – Go Your Own Way

 Bizarrap, Shakira – Shakira: Bzrp Music Sessions, Vol. 53

 Lilly Allen — West End Girl, Madeline, 4chanstan

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Lily Allen and Tate McRae revive the revenge anthem

Charlie Puth breaks down his new single "Changes," a maximalist eighties production hiding a melancholy story about drifting friendships. As he prepares for fatherhood, the singer-songwriter reflects on how relationships evolve from deep conversations to small talk, why he listens to lyrics last, and his belief that music should offer a three-minute escape from life's exhaustion. Between demonstrating vocal techniques, championing forgotten producer Rod Temperton, and turning "You Are My Sunshine" into a minor-key lullaby, Puth makes his case for earning the title "Professor," with one simple lesson: stop overthinking and just feel the music.

Songs Discussed

Wiz Khalifa feat. Charlie Puth "See You Again"Charlie Puth "Attention"Charlie Puth "Changes"Charlie Puth "Hero"The Weeknd "Blinding Lights"Dua Lipa "Physical"Olivia Newton-John "Physical"Phil Collins "In the Air Tonight"Tears for Fears "Everybody Wants to Rule the World"Heatwave "The Groove Line"Tamia "You Put a Move on My Heart"Heatwave "All You Do Is Dial"Michael Jackson "Thriller"Traditional "You Are My Sunshine"
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Can “professor” Charlie Puth pass our qualifying exam?

On October 14th, the visionary musician D’Angelo passed away at 51 years old. Only releasing three albums during his lifetime, he synthesized influences from gospel, jazz, rock, and hip-hop to create a singular and transcendent sound artists still try – and fail – to emulate today. 

On this special episode of Switched On Pop, Charlie and Nate are joined by producer Reanna and engineer Brandon to celebrate D’Angelo through his music, discussing one song from each of his albums and highlighting his musical genius.

Songs Discussed

 D’Angelo – Untitled (How Does It Feel)

 D’Angelo – Brown Sugar

 The Hawkins Family – What Is This?

 D’Angelo – Feel Like Makin’ Love

 Roberta Flack – Feel Like Makin’ Love

 Parliament – Give Up The Funk (Tear The Roof Off The Sucker)

 D’Angelo – Cruisin’

 Smokey Robinson – Cruisin’

 D’Angelo – The Charade

 Curtis Mayfield – (Don’t Worry) If There Is A Hell Below, We’re All Going to Go

 Jimi Hendrix – All Along The Watchtower

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How D'Angelo changed music, in three songs

John C. Reilly joins to discuss Mr. Romantic, his theatrical tribute to the Great American Songbook that treats Irving Berlin and Tom Waits as equals in the canon of timeless American song. Reilly recorded live in one room with his band using vintage ribbon microphones, embracing the squeaks and imperfections while layering in cinematic sound effects—crickets outside a lover's window, a collect call from prison—to transform each standard into an immersive scene. But what makes a song from the 1920s feel eternal? Music data scientist Chris Dalla Riva, author of the forthcoming Uncharted Territory and the newsletter Can't Get Much Higher, breaks down how composers like the Gershwins wrote for amateur musicians playing sheet music at home, creating universal lyrics and AABA structures where the hook comes first. That accessibility is precisely what draws Reilly to this repertoire. He sees himself in the lineage of interpreters like Sinatra, not selling his own story but passing along music that already belongs to all of us, like holding up a seashell and saying, "Isn't this one beautiful?"

More

 Get Chris Dalla Riva's book Uncharted Territory: What Numbers Tell Us about the Biggest Hit Songs and Ourselves

 Subscribe to Chris Dalla Riva's Can't Get Much Higher

Songs Discussed

 Taylor Swift "The Last Great American Dynasty"

 George Gershwin "I Got Rhythm"

 Village People "Y.M.C.A."

 Billie Eilish "Bad Guy"

 Frank Sinatra "On the Sunny Side of the Street"

 Judy Garland "Over the Rainbow"

 Ella Fitzgerald "My Romance"

 George Gershwin "But Not for Me"

 Elvis Presley "Are You Lonesome Tonight"

 The Beatles "We Can Work It Out"

 The Beatles "Get Back"

 The Beatles "Yesterday"

 John C. Reilly "Moonlight Serenade"

 John C. Reilly "Dreams"

 John C. Reilly "Johnsburg, Illinois"

 John C. Reilly "Falling in Love Again"

 John C. Reilly "What'll I Do"

 John C. Reilly "Picture in a Frame"

 John C. Reilly "Just Another Sucker on the Vine"

 Randy Newman "Ragtime"

 John C. Reilly & David Garza "What's Not To Love"

 Harry Nilsson "Coconut"

 Judy Garland "Somewhere Over the Rainbow"

 Dooley Wilson "As Time Goes By"

 The New Vaudeville Band "Winchester Cathedral"

 Andy Williams "The Days of Wine and Roses"

 Nat King Cole "The Frim Fram Sauce"

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What do John C. Reilly and Taylor Swift have in common? The Great American Songbook

Taylor Swift's twelfth album has sparked endless speculation about who each song is "really about," but that might be the wrong question entirely. The Life of a Showgirl isn’t biography, it’s polyphonic auto-fiction, where Swift writes from multiple character perspectives while blurring the lines between autobiography and theatrical performance. The album's "showgirl sound" traces from Shakespearean tragedy (Ophelia's drowning rewritten as salvation) through Golden Age Hollywood orchestration to contemporary pop production with Max Martin and Shellback. Unusual musical choices like the jarring five-measure phrase in "Fate of Ophelia" reinforce the album's central theme: the tension between public performance and private reality. By treating the album as a theatrical show rather than a celebrity tell-all, listeners can finally hear what Swift is actually saying… or can they?

Vote for Switched On Pop in this year's Signal Awards! We're nominated for ⁠Best Music Podcast⁠ and ⁠Best Original Score/Music⁠, linked here. Thank you!

Songs Discussed

 Taylor Swift "Love Story"

 Taylor Swift "Blank Space"

 Taylor Swift "The Fate of Ophelia"

 Taylor Swift "Elizabeth Taylor"

 Irving Berlin "A Pretty Girl Is Like a Melody"

 Fred Astaire "Puttin' on the Ritz"

 Taylor Swift "Opalite"

 George Michael "Father Figure"

 Taylor Swift "Father Figure"

 Taylor Swift "Eldest Daughter"

 Taylor Swift "Tim McGraw"

 Taylor Swift "Ruined the Friendship"

 Weezer "Beverly Hills"

 Pixies "Where Is My Mind"

 Charli XCX "Sympathy Is a Knife"

 Charli XCX "Everything Is Romantic"

 Taylor Swift "Actually Romantic"

 Mean Girls "Meet the Plastics"

 Taylor Swift "Wi$h Li$t"

 Stevie Wonder "Superstition"

 The Jackson 5 "I Want You Back"

 Taylor Swift "Wood"

 Nirvana "Lithium"

 Nirvana "Something in the Way"

 Taylor Swift "Canceled"

 Taylor Swift "Honey"

 Taylor Swift feat. Sabrina Carpenter "Life of a Showgirl"

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Taylor Swift’s Showgirl Sound: How to actually listen to the album

There's no lead singer in Trousdale. The trio of Quinn D'Andrea, Georgia Greene, and Lauren Jones, has shared vocal duties equally since they started singing together as students at the University of Southern California's Thornton School of Music. Since then, they've touring the world and released a sophomore album, Growing Pains, that features the trio's impeccable harmonies over 70s-inflected country-rock grooves. In this episode, Trousdale returns to their alma mater to play acoustic versions of "Growing Pains" and "Secondhand Smoke" and then speak to Professor Nate (plus an audience of music students) about how they forged their indivisible sound. 

Songs Discussed 

Trousdale - Growing Pains, Over and Over, Lonely Nights, Movie Star

Jackson Browne - Doctor My Eyes

MIKA - Grace Kelly
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The Power of the Trio (ft. Trousdale live at USC)

This summer, one singular artist could be heard everywhere from the new Cardi B album to the TikTok charts: Janet Jackson. The incomparable Queen of Pop has had her fingerprints all over pop music for the past few months, and it’s never been more apparent than on Doja Cat’s “Jealous Type.” The lead single from Doja’s new album Vie has all the hallmarks of the Janet Jackson sound, from breathy and percussive vocals to nods to iconic production from Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis.

This episode of Switched on Pop, we go on a journey guided by Janet, and discover the implicit connections to Doja Cat – the so-called “queen of pop-rap” – in the process.

Vote for Switched On Pop in this year's Signal Awards! We're nominated for Best Music Podcast and Best Original Score/Music, linked here. Thank you!

Songs discussed:

 Janet Jackson – Someone To Call My Lover

 Sabrina Carpenter – House Tour

 Cardi B, Janet Jackson – Principal (feat. Janet Jackson)

 Doja Cat – Jealous Type

 Janet Jackson – What Have You Done For Me Lately

 Janet Jackson – Nasty

 Janet Jackson – Feedback

 Janet Jackson – What About

 Prince – 1999

 Janet Jackson – Throb

 Janet Jackson – Control

 Janet Jackson – When I Think Of You

 Janet Jackson – Go Deep

 Doja Cat – Cyber Sex

 Doja Cat – Rules

 Doja Cat – Boss Bitch

 Doja Cat – Woman

 Doja Cat – Agora Hills

 Janet Jackson – Let’s Wait Awhile

 Janet Jackson – Escapade

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Lily Allen and Tate McRae revive the revenge anthem

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