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Michael Shermer

The Michael Shermer Show is a series of long-form conversations between Dr. Michael Shermer and leading scientists, philosophers, historians, scholars, writers and thinkers about the most important issues of our time.

The Michael Shermer Show

In 2010, in a small New Hampshire town, next door to a copy center and framing shop, a ghost lab opened. The Kitt Research Initiative’s mission was to use the scientific method to document the existence of spirits. Founder Andy Kitt was known as a straight-shooter; he was unafraid—perhaps eager—to offend other paranormal investigators by exposing the fraudulence of their less advanced techniques. But when KRI started to lose money, Kitt began to seek funding from the paranormal community, attracting flocks of psychics, alien abductees, witches, mediums, ghost hunters, UFOlogists, cryptozoologists and warlocks from all over New England, and the world. And there were plenty of them around.
 
Matthew Hongoltz-Hetling, author of the new book The Ghost Lab, explains the wild ecosystem of paranormal profiteers and consumers through the astonishing story of what happened in this one small town. He also maps the trends of declining scientific literacy, trust in institutions, and the diffusion of a culture that has created space for armies of pseudoscientists to step into the minds of an increasingly credulous public.
 
Matthew Hongoltz-Hetling is a freelance journalist specializing in narrative features and investigative reporting. He was a finalist for the Pulitzer Prize. He is the author of A Libertarian Walks Into a Bearand It Sounds Like a Quack. His new book is The Ghost Lab: How Bigfoot Hunters, Mediums, and Alien Enthusiasts are Wrecking Science.

Believing Is Seeing: Inside the Modern Paranormal Movement

Phil Tinline, author of the new book Ghosts of Iron Mountain, explores the origins of the infamous Report from Iron Mountain, its role in conspiracy culture, and its lasting influence on perceptions of the military-industrial complex. The conversation also examines Holocaust denial, nativism, and the evolution of deep state conspiracies, highlighting the power of narratives in shaping democracy and public trust.
 
Tinline is a British freelance writer and documentarian. His book The Death of Consensus: 100 Years of British Political Nightmares was named The Times (London) Politics Book of the Year. Over two decades at the BBC, he has produced and presented acclaimed documentaries on the impact of political history on contemporary life.

The Hoax of the Century: Iron Mountain

A few reflections on religion following The Free Press debate in Austin, TX on February 27, 2025.
 
Michael Shermer and Adam Carolla (atheists) faced off against Ayaan Hirsi Ali and Ross Douthat (Christians).
 
You can watch the debate here: https://www.thefp.com/p/watch-does-the-west-need-a-religious

Does the West Need a Religious Revival? (Shermer Solo)

Michael Shermer and Jeff Sebo explore moral philosophy, focusing on animal rights, sentience, and consciousness. They discuss the definitions of morality, ethical pluralism, and the divide between consequentialism and deontology. The conversation examines who belongs in our moral circle, the ethics of insect farming, the future of animal agriculture, abortion, and whether advanced AI could be considered sentient beings or even co-citizens.

Who Counts? Ethics in the Treatment of Animals and AI

In our 501st episode, Michael Shermer takes a moment to reflect on his long journey with skepticism and what he learned recording half a thousand episodes of this podcast. He shares his thoughts on what it means for something to be truly “real” by comparing our personal experiences with evidence-backed facts, tackles the challenge of controversial and extraordinary claims, and even explores how mystical ideas or literary works can offer their own kind of truth.

Half a Thousand Episodes: Still Chasing Truth

What happens to American democracy if Christianity is no longer able, or no longer willing, to perform the functions on which our constitutional order depends? Jonathan Rauch—a lifelong atheist—reckons candidly with both the shortcomings of secularism and the corrosion of Christianity.
 
Thin Christianity, as Rauch calls the mainline church, has been unable to inspire and retain believers. Worse, a Church of Fear has distorted white evangelicalism in ways that violate the tenets of both Jesus and James Madison. What to do? For answers, Rauch looks to a new generation of religious thinkers, as well as to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, which has placed the Constitution at the heart of its spiritual teachings.
 
In this timely critique Rauch addresses secular Americans who think Christianity can be abandoned, and Christian Americans who blame secular culture for their grievances. The two must work together, he argues, to confront our present crisis. He calls on Christians to recommit to the teachings of their faith that align with Madison, not MAGA, and to understand that liberal democracy, far from being oppressive, is uniquely protective of religious freedom. At the same time, he calls on secular liberals to understand that healthy religious institutions are crucial to the survival of the liberal state.
 
Jonathan Rauch is a senior fellow in the Governance Studies program at the Brookings Institution in Washington DC and a contributing writer of The Atlantic. His new book is Cross Purposes: Christianity’s Broken Bargain with Democracy.

The Faith Deficit: Does America Need a Spiritual Backbone?

William Green delves into the lives of iconic investors like Buffett, Munger, and Templeton, unraveling how their approaches extend beyond financial success. These super-investors possess unique skills such as rigorous thinking, resilience, and intuition. Through years of interviews, Green reveals how their principles can improve decision-making, manage risks, and help us thrive in uncertain environments.
 
William Green has written for top publications like Time, Forbes, and The Economist, and edited Time’s Asian and European editions. He coauthored several books, including Guy Spier’s The Education of a Value Investor. Born in London, he studied English at Oxford and earned a journalism master’s at Columbia. Now based in New York, he lives with his family. His latest book is Richer, Wiser, Happier: How the World’s Greatest Investors Win in Markets and Life.
 
Shermer and Green discuss the financial literacy of Americans, the mechanics of wealth creation, and the psychology behind investment decisions. They cover the stock market, the importance of resilience, and the relationship between money, happiness, and luck. The conversation includes wisdom from legendary investors, the power of compound interest, and practical strategies for financial independence.

How the Greatest Investors Win in Life and Markets

In the U.S. alone, more than $400 billion are donated to charity each year—equivalent to two percent of American GDP. This generosity is wonderful, but these gifts don’t do nearly as much good as they could. In recent years, researchers have started studying the effectiveness of different charities, just as investors study the effectiveness of different companies. These researchers ask questions like: How much money does it cost for this charity to save someone’s life? The answers are stunning. Charity experts estimate that the most effective charities are about 100 times more effective than typical charities. For example, you can do more good by donating $100 to a highly effective charity than by donating $10,000 to a typical charity.
 
Shermer and Greene discuss effective altruism, evidence-based philanthropy, and GivingMultiplier’s unique model for maximizing charitable impact. They explore moral judgment theories, from deontology to consequentialism, and delve into complex topics like donor fatigue, public vs. private solutions, abortion, capital punishment, and political polarization. Greene shares practical insights into addressing societal divides and inspiring collective action.
 
Joshua Greene is a Professor of Psychology at Harvard, where he teaches “Evolving Morality: From Primordial Soup to Superintelligent Machines,” one of the university’s most popular courses. He is also the author of Moral Tribes: Emotion, Reason, and the Gap Between Us and Them, which integrates moral philosophy, psychology, and neuroscience to explain the underlying causes of modern conflict. Josh’s latest applied research has led to novel, evidence-based strategies for reducing political animosity and inspiring thousands of people to support nonprofits addressing extreme poverty, climate change, and other pressing societal issues. His new organization is GivingMultiplier.org.

Evidence-Based Charity and Moral Psychology

Guy P. Harrison is an acclaimed author of nine thought-provoking books that encourage curiosity and critical thinking. In this engaging episode, he and Michael Shermer discuss how science fiction inspires us to think beyond the ordinary and explore the vast possibilities of human progress. From his latest work to his passion for rational dialogue, Harrison’s insights are both inspiring and accessible.
 
Shermer and Harrison tackle a diverse range of topics, including the societal value of science fiction, the flawed debates about religion and evolution, and why humanity might ultimately prevail despite existential threats like AI. They examine UFOs and the Fermi Paradox, discuss redefining atheism, and share optimism about human progress. Harrison’s engaging insights inspire curiosity and critical thinking throughout the episode.
 
Guy Harrison is an award-winning writer and author of nine books, including Think: Why You Should Question Everything, At Least Know This, 50 Reasons People Give for Believing in a God, and Good Thinking. His work has been featured in Skeptic, Reader’s Digest, The Institute of Arts and Ideas, Skeptical Inquirer, Free Inquiry, Big Think, and many other publications. Guy is a longtime essayist for Psychology Today and contributed a chapter about race and racism to The Cognitive Science of Beliefpublished by Cambridge University Press. Random House featured his book Think: Why You Should Question Everything as recommended reading for all first-year university students, and the San Diego Union-Tribunenamed At Least Know This a top-five summer read. His new book, Damn You, Entropy! 1,001 of the Greatest Science Fiction Quotes was a New Scientist magazine “Best Science Fiction Books of the Month” selection.

Rationality, Science Fiction, and Humanity’s Future

In this thought-provoking conversation, Dan Barker, a former evangelical preacher turned prominent atheist and co-president of the Freedom from Religion Foundation, explains the current state of separation of Church and State, the influence of Catholicism on the Supreme Court, and the ongoing debates surrounding public education and religious symbols.
 
Barker also discusses the legal challenges tackled by his organization, and introduces “Contraduction,” a new philosophical concept that reexamines how beliefs and arguments can reverse in order and meaning.
 
Plus, the moral implications of belief systems and the fine-tuning argument for the existence of God, the nature of nothingness, and free will.
 
Dan Barker is co-president of the Freedom From Religion Foundation, co-host of Freethought Radio, and co-founder of The Clergy Project. He worked 19 years as an evangelical minister and is a member of the Lenape (Delaware) tribe of American Indians. His new book is Contraduction.

The Current State of Atheism and Separation of Church and State

Dr. Robert Trivers and Dr. Michael Shermer have a lively conversation on everything from evolutionary theory and human nature to how to win a knife fight and Trivers’ membership in the Black Panthers. Don’t miss this engaging exchange with one of the most interesting scientists of the past half century.

16. Dr. Robert Trivers — Evolutionary Theory & Human Nature

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