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Kelly Chase & Jay Christopher King

Reality isn’t what you’ve been told. Cosmosis is your portal to the mysteries of UFOs, consciousness, non-human intelligence, and the unknown. Hosted by Kelly Chase and Jay Christopher King, this channel is your gateway to conversations at the bleeding edge of human discovery and the hidden forces shaping our world.

We bring you in-depth interviews with the most compelling voices in the field—researchers, experiencers, scientists, and visionaries—who challenge mainstream narratives and push the limits of what we think we know.

If you're ready to question everything and embrace the mystery, you're in the right place. Subscribe now and join us on the journey.

Learn more at Cosmosis.Media

The UFO Rabbit Hole Podcast

Content Warning: Sexual assault 

In this episode, I had the pleasure of sitting down with someone that I regard to be one of the best minds and brightest lights in this field, Whitley Strieber. Whitley Strieber is an author of both fiction and nonfiction books, perhaps the most famous of which is his pioneering 1987 book Communion, which detailed his experience of abduction that occurred in the winter of 1985. Since then, Whitley has made many other contributions to the field including his most recent book entitled Them, and the book Super Natural which he co-wrote with Jeffrey J. Kripal, both of which have been referenced several times on this podcast. Whitley is also the host of the long-running Dreamland podcast. You can find links to all of this and more in the episode brief.

Whitley’s work has been instrumental to my thinking and growth in this space, and I’m so grateful for both his courage and generosity in sharing his time and his insights.

NEW Class from Dr. James Madden
Unidentified Flying Hyperobject: UFOs, Philosophy, and the End of the World
Four-week online class via Zoom
Wednesdays, March 27 – April 24 (skips April 10), 2024
7 – 9 pm ET

Learn More About the Class
Sign Up Now

 

EPISODE BRIEF

MORE FROM WHITLEY STRIEBER
Books by Whitley Strieber
Dreamland Podcast
Unknown Country
Follow Whitley on X

MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE
Terrible, Glorious, & Useful by Trevor Shikaze

BECOME A PATRON
Patrons get lots of great perks like early and ad-free episodes, access to the private The UFO Rabbit Hole Discord server, and twice-monthly Patron Zoom calls with Kelly Chase.

Memberships start at just $5/month.

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[The UFO Rabbit Hole] Ep 33: An Interview with Whitley Strieber: On Communion with Non-Human Intelligences

In the long-awaited part two of the Through the Looking Glass series, host Kelly Chase is back to tell the bizarre story of the events following her anomalous experience from part one, and how a string of unlikely events brought her to the story of an experiencer with strange psi abilities named Tom Matte. Tom developed what he describes as an interactive holographic overlay on his reality which he calls Upsight in the aftermath of dramatic mental breakdown. More than a decade later, he is still seeking answers about Upsight which he says allows him to access non-local information in fascinating ways and even communicate with NHIs. 

After a string of unbelievable synchronicities, Kelly found that her story had become inextricably tied to Tom’s, leading her on a journey of inquiry about the nature of anomalous experiences, mental illness, addiction, and more. In this episode she dives deep into this strange tale and the insights and revelations that it spurred. 

*****************************

Cosmosis: UFOs & A New Reality Drops on Apple TV on December 30, 2024.
Watch the Cosmosis Trailer

*****************************

The Institute of Noetic Sciences
Learn More
Donate

Follow Tom Matte
Jesus Goes To Hollywood: A Memoir of Madness
X/Twitter
Website
Medium

Mentioned in this Episode
Olof Rockner
Illustrations of Upsight by Olof Rockner

Jaws PosterGreys Remote Viewing a TownOther ExampleOther ExampleOther ExampleOther ExampleOther Example
Tom’s Paper About Dark Matter & Dark Energy

Spiritual Emergency: When Personal Transformation Becomes a Crisis

 

BECOME A PATRON
Patrons get lots of great perks like early and ad-free episodes, access to the private The UFO Rabbit Hole Discord server, and twice-monthly Patron Zoom calls with Kelly Chase.

Memberships start at just $5/month.

GET THE BOOK
Get a SIGNED COPY
Get it on Amazon

FOLLOW
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[The UFO Rabbit Hole] Ep 38: Through The Looking Glass [Pt 2]: The Strange Tale of Tom Matte & Upsight

The docuseries that I've spent the last year working on, Cosmosis: UFOs & A New Reality, drops today. It would mean the world to me if you would check it out. It's currently available in the U.S., Canada, Great Britain, and Australia. We're working on more international options, but it's an expensive and complicated process, so thank you for your patience and understanding as we work through that. 

Watch Cosmosis on Apple TV

Watch Cosmosis on Amazon Prime

Watch Cosmosis on YouTube

[The UFO Rabbit Hole] Cosmosis: UFOs & A New Reality Drops Today!

All good things must come to an end. And this podcast, and the international community that has sprung up around it, has been a very good thing. It’s been one of the best things in my life. Which is why it’s hard to actually say the words that this episode will be the last episode of The UFO Rabbit Hole. 

But before you panic—this isn’t the end. It’s just the beginning.

Tune in to find out about the future of the podcast, and to say good-bye to The UFO Rabbit Hole.

See Karl Nell's Sol Talk

Watch Cosmosis: UFOs & A New Reality

[The UFO Rabbit Hole] The Final Episode: It's The End Of The World As We Know It

In the first episode of Cosmosis, we’re bringing you one of the most compelling experiencer stories we’ve ever encountered. Courtney Leffall had never told his story publicly before it appeared in our docuseries Cosmosis: UFOs & A New Reality, and once you hear it, you’ll understand why. His experiences don’t fit neatly into any single category—crossing the boundaries between psi phenomena, precognition, UFO encounters, messages from dead ancestors, and even the eerie mystery of cattle mutilations.

There’s a hidden thread connecting these phenomena—one that the mainstream conversation about UFOs often ignores. Courtney’s story is a rare and striking example of how deep that thread runs and how impossible it is to untangle. His experiences force us to confront an unsettling question: What if the reality we think we know is just the smallest fraction of what actually exists?

Watch Cosmosis: UFOs & A New Reality:
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Contact Us:
info@ontocalypse.com

Ep 1: Courtney Leffall [Pt 1]: UFOs, Psi, and a Paranormal Legacy

See the full interview on YouTube here: https://youtu.be/EStI_rnPDRU

In this episode of Cosmosis, Kelly Chase and Jay Christopher King welcome back experiencer Courtney Leffall, whose story was featured in Cosmosis: UFOs & A New Reality. Together, they explore the deeply personal and societal implications of anomalous experiences, the role of disclosure, and how we integrate these experiences into our lives. Courtney shares his thoughts on government transparency, the connection between UFOs and ancestral spirits, and the need for interdisciplinary collaboration in understanding these phenomena.

This episode of Cosmosis offers a deeply personal and intellectual dive into the experiencer phenomenon, government disclosure, and the spiritual implications of UFO contact. Courtney Leffall provides a unique and necessary perspective, bridging religious, cultural, and experiencer narratives to offer a more holistic view of what may be unfolding.

Listeners are left with a challenge: Can we break down our own biases and expand the conversation to include perspectives we may have previously dismissed?

Watch Cosmosis: UFOs & A New Reality:
https://www.cosmosis.media/
Join the Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/cosmosismedia

Subscribe to Cosmosis:
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Cosmosis.Podcast
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Listen to the Cosmosis Soundtrack by Michael Rubino:
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/album/5Xvs2NAHNbKjfW7hWkjqey?si=pJPPgIPsRZGkZjJh19UULQ
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Contact Us: info@ontocalypse.com

Timestamps & Key Topics:

00:00:00 – Introduction: Future Human Hypothesis & Consciousness 00:01:12 – Welcome & Podcast Background
00:03:25 – Courtney’s UFO Encounter: Intelligent Control
00:05:37 – What Disclosure Means: Government Transparency & Secrecy 00:08:14 – Trust & Testimony: Do We Need Government Validation? 00:14:09 – High Strangeness: Beyond UFO Sightings
00:18:42 – Breaking Silos: Scientists, Experiencers & Philosophers 00:23:56 – Integrating Anomalous Experiences: Self-Acceptance 00:29:33 – UFOs & The Dead: Ancestral Spirits & Contact
00:38:21 – CE5 & Summoning: The Risks of Contact
00:45:45 – Are UFOs Demonic? Faith & The Phenomenon
00:51:18 – Race, Culture & The UFO Community
00:58:06 – Inclusivity: Expanding the Conversation
01:08:44 – What the Phenomenon Tells Us About Humanity
01:11:29 – Final Thoughts & Call to Action

Ep 2: Courtney Leffall [Pt 2]: Integrating the Anomalous

See the full interview on YouTube here: https://youtu.be/s4IDqWGlWBU

In this thought-provoking conversation, legendary author and experiencer Whitley Strieber joins Kelly and Jay to discuss his groundbreaking new book, The Fourth Mind. Whitley explores the anatomy, intelligence, and consciousness of the beings he refers to as "the Visitors"—entities many associate with the Greys. He shares profound insights into their nature, their relationship to time, and why their presence on Earth may be more intertwined with us than we realize.

This episode takes a deep dive into:

🔹 How our brains struggle to process encounters with the unknown

🔹 The concept of the "fourth mind" and why it's missing in us but not in them

🔹 The Visitors' relationship to time and their desperate need to reconnect with the present moment

🔹 The risks and rewards of telepathic contact with non-human intelligence

🔹 The role of experiencers in shaping our collective understanding of these phenomena

Whitley also opens up about his lifelong experiences, the mysterious nature of the Visitors, and the deeper implications of our interactions with them. Prepare for a conversation that will challenge your perceptions of reality.

Mentioned in This Episode

📖 The Fourth Mind by Whitley Strieber –https://a.co/d/3Tj8G2i

📚 Them by Whitley Strieber – https://a.co/d/gqYziUQ

🎥 Cosmosis: UFOs & A New Reality – Watch at Cosmosis.Media

🎙️ Dreamland Podcast – Hosted by Whitley Strieber at UnknownCountry.com

💫 Stay Tuned for Part 2 Next Week!

Watch Cosmosis: UFOs & A New Reality:
https://www.cosmosis.media/

Join the Patreon: 
https://www.patreon.com/cosmosismedia

Subscribe to Cosmosis:
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Cosmosis.Podcast
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7KnyktIs059pbVdccD020D?si=f3835f36a8cb479d
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/cosmosis-formerly-the-ufo-rabbit-hole/id1595590107

Follow Cosmosis
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Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/share/12EEyNVPucu/?mibextid=wwXIfr
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Listen to the Cosmosis Soundtrack by Michael Rubino:
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/album/5Xvs2NAHNbKjfW7hWkjqey?si=pJPPgIPsRZGkZjJh19UULQ
Apple Music: https://music.apple.com/us/album/cosmosis-ufos-a-new-reality-season-one-original-soundtrack/1788465117
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Contact Us:
info@ontocalypse.com

TIMESTAMPS:

00:00 Introduction and Welcome

01:43 Introducing Whitley Strieber

06:16 Exploring the Fourth Mind Concept

09:57 The Visitors and Their Nature

14:34 Communion and Its Significance

19:57 Differences and Similarities with the Grays

28:01 The Role of the Visitors in Human History

33:07 Exploring Subjectivity and Objectivity in Phenomena

37:01 Meditation and Contact Work

38:44 The Nature of the Greys

40:28 Experiencing the Visitors

47:37 The Importance of Telepathy

01:00:16 The Urgency of the Fourth Mind

01:03:10 Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Ep 3: Whitley Strieber: The Fourth Mind & Our Surprising Connection to NHIs

Watch the full video interview on YouTube: https://youtu.be/kF8yImSnX1Y

In this gripping continuation of our conversation with legendary author and experiencer Whitley Strieber, we venture even deeper into the nature of the Visitors—what they are, how they relate to time, and what it truly means to engage with an intelligence that exists just beyond the limits of human comprehension.

This episode challenges the boundaries of our understanding as Whitley explores:
🔹 The role of human consciousness in shaping contact phenomena
🔹 Why the living and the dead must work together to reach the next stage of evolution
🔹 The hidden reality of telepathic communication and its profound implications
🔹 How social engineering and stigma have shaped the UFO narrative—and why that’s changing
🔹 The military’s secret interest in experiencers and the possible manipulation of contact phenomena

Whitley also shares deeply personal insights into his own experiences, the afterlife, and the unseen forces at play in our reality. This is a conversation that demands reflection, openness, and a willingness to embrace the unknown.

📖 The Fourth Mind by Whitley Strieber – https://a.co/d/3Tj8G2i
📚 Them by Whitley Strieber – https://a.co/d/gqYziUQ
🎥 Cosmosis: UFOs & A New Reality – Watch at Cosmosis.Media
🎙️ Dreamland Podcast – Hosted by Whitley Strieber at UnknownCountry.com

Watch Cosmosis: UFOs & A New Reality:
https://www.cosmosis.media/

Join the Patreon: 
https://www.patreon.com/cosmosismedia

Subscribe to Cosmosis:
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Cosmosis.Podcast
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7KnyktIs059pbVdccD020D?si=f3835f36a8cb479d
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/cosmosis-formerly-the-ufo-rabbit-hole/id1595590107

Follow Cosmosis
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Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/share/12EEyNVPucu/?mibextid=wwXIfr
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Listen to the Cosmosis Soundtrack by Michael Rubino:
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/album/5Xvs2NAHNbKjfW7hWkjqey?si=pJPPgIPsRZGkZjJh19UULQ
Apple Music: https://music.apple.com/us/album/cosmosis-ufos-a-new-reality-season-one-original-soundtrack/1788465117
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TIMESTAMPS
00:00 Introduction 
03:46 Clip from Cosmosis: UFOs and a New Reality
05:45 The Role of Human Consciousness in Encounters
06:26 Historical and Cultural Context of Encounters
11:31 The Importance of Telepathy
12:31 Challenges in Understanding and Acceptance
13:51 Navigating Disinformation and Manipulation
27:15 Personal Experiences and Integration
33:02 The Stigma and Scientific Resistance
53:18 Final Thoughts and Future Directions

Ep 4: Whitley Strieber: Contact, Telepathy, and the Veil Between Worlds

For fans of the old school deep dives from The UFO Rabbit Hole, this episode is for you. 

For many, the biggest challenge in engaging with UFOs, NHIs, and the anomalous isn’t a lack of evidence, but the nature of the evidence itself. The best data we have comes from experiencers—those who have directly encountered the unknown. But their stories are often so strange, so far outside of our frameworks, that even the most open-minded struggle with how to approach them.

In this episode, Kelly Chase and Jay Christopher King take on this challenge head-on, exploring:

🔹 Why experiencer testimony is the most important—and most misunderstood—source of insight into the phenomenon
🔹 The impact of memory, trauma, and perception on anomalous encounters
🔹 How bias, belief systems, and cultural stigma shape the UFO narrative
🔹 The role of consciousness in contact phenomena—and why reality may be stranger than we think
🔹 How to listen to experiencer narratives with both discernment and radical openness

We also examine cutting-edge models from Jacques Vallée, Eric Davis, Diana Pasulka, Jeffrey Kripal, James Madden, and others, to uncover new ways of understanding the impossible.

This episode isn’t just about listening—it’s about learning to perceive the phenomenon in an entirely new way.

 

———————————————————————
Thank you to Magic Mind for sponsoring this episode. 

Try Magic Mind

If you’re like to try Magic Mind, go to https://www.magicmind.com/cosmosis and use code COSMOSIS20 to get you up to 48% off your first subscription for the next 10 days or 20% off for a one-time purchase. 

Check out the science behind Magic Mind: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1J7lHKMS_LqwWNvAIujShBs4IbCzsgOM_/view?pli=1
———————————————————————
 

Mentioned in This Episode
📖 American Cosmic by Diana Walsh Pasulka – [https://a.co/d/fYxuZ2m]
📖 Unidentified Flying Hyper Object by James Madden – [https://a.co/d/iVOtkYA]
📖 The Case Against Reality by Donald Hoffman – [https://a.co/d/4yKbKNa]
📖 Hyperobjects: Philosophy and Ecology After the End of the World by Timothy Morton – [https://a.co/d/i8u1qaz]
📖 Incommensurability, Orthodoxy, and the Physics of High Strangeness by Jacques Vallée & Eric Davis – [Read here: https://www.academia.edu/36788970/Incommensurability_Orthodoxy_and_the_Physics_of_High_Strangeness_A_six_layer_model_for_Anomalous_Phenomena]
🎙️ The Experiencer Group – Support at [https://tegmembers.com]

Support The Experiencer Group:
https://www.paypal.com/donate/?hosted_button_id=TBPJNDVY9QJFU

Watch Cosmosis: UFOs & A New Reality:
https://www.cosmosis.media/

Join the Patreon: 
https://www.patreon.com/cosmosismedia

Subscribe to Cosmosis:
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Cosmosis.Podcast
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7KnyktIs059pbVdccD020D?si=f3835f36a8cb479d
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/cosmosis-formerly-the-ufo-rabbit-hole/id1595590107

Follow Cosmosis
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Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/share/12EEyNVPucu/?mibextid=wwXIfr
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/cosmosis.media

Listen to the Cosmosis Soundtrack by Michael Rubino:
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/album/5Xvs2NAHNbKjfW7hWkjqey?si=pJPPgIPsRZGkZjJh19UULQ
Apple Music: https://music.apple.com/us/album/cosmosis-ufos-a-new-reality-season-one-original-soundtrack/1788465117
Amazon: https://amazon.com/music/player/albums/B0DS5WY5CB?marketplaceId=ATVPDKIKX0DER&musicTerritory=US&ref=dm_sh_zY05XPzhLhuow5dAgK3g2W9yC

 

TIMESTAMPS
03:23 The Challenge of UFO Testimonies
04:35 The Nature of Extraordinary Evidence
06:31 The Complexity of Experiencer Narratives
13:08 The Role of Trauma and Memory
14:29 The Experiencer Group and Its Mission
15:41 Subjectivity and Inconsistencies in Reports
19:01 The Bigger Picture of Anomalous Experiences
21:40 Philosophical Perspectives on Truth and Reality
25:45 Quantum Mechanics and Anomalous Experiences
28:29 Frameworks for Understanding the Phenomenon
29:57 The Concept of Redaction in UFO Narratives
32:44 The Nature of Redaction in UFO Testimonies
34:05 Navigating Redaction in Experiencer Testimonies
37:05 The Six-Layer Model of Anomalous Phenomena
44:16 The Filter Thesis and Anomalous Experiences
48:53 Trauma, Mental Health, and Substance Abuse in Experiencers
53:55 Hyperobjects and the Nature of UFO Phenomena
56:55 Semiotics and the Interpretation of Anomalous Encounters
01:00:44 Conclusion: Embracing the Unknown

Ep 5: Beyond The Telling: Listening To & Interpreting Experiencer Narratives

Watch the full video on YouTube: https://youtu.be/JfwIlrLVyLs

In this episode of Cosmosis, we share a never-before-released talk by Dr. Diana Walsh Pasulka, recorded live at the Inquire Anomalous conference in New York City. Diana—religious studies professor and author of American Cosmic and Encounters—takes us on an astonishing journey through her research into Catholic mysticism, Vatican archives, and modern UFO contact experiences.

From levitating saints and the mysterious Woman in Blue to redacted mystical narratives and the ontological shock of encountering the impossible, Diana reveals surprising links between ancient religious experiences and contemporary reports of contact with non-human intelligences. She also speaks candidly about her own transformation, the eerie resonances between the sacred and the anomalous, and her collaboration with figures like Tyler D. and Dr. Garry Nolan on the frontier of space, consciousness, and belief.

This episode includes the full live Q&A with Diana—where she responds to insightful (and sometimes wild) audience questions about redaction, religious symbolism, and whether spiritual devotion might offer protection from malevolent entities.

🔗 Learn more about Diana’s work and online courses: https://dwpasulka.com

Watch Cosmosis: UFOs & A New Reality:
https://www.cosmosis.media/

Join the Patreon: 
https://www.patreon.com/cosmosismedia

Subscribe to Cosmosis:
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Cosmosis.Podcast
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7KnyktIs059pbVdccD020D?si=f3835f36a8cb479d
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/cosmosis-formerly-the-ufo-rabbit-hole/id1595590107

Follow Cosmosis
X: https://x.com/cosmosis_media
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/share/12EEyNVPucu/?mibextid=wwXIfr
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/cosmosis.media

Listen to the Cosmosis Soundtrack by Michael Rubino:
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/album/5Xvs2NAHNbKjfW7hWkjqey?si=pJPPgIPsRZGkZjJh19UULQ
Apple Music: https://music.apple.com/us/album/cosmosis-ufos-a-new-reality-season-one-original-soundtrack/1788465117
Amazon: https://amazon.com/music/player/albums/B0DS5WY5CB?marketplaceId=ATVPDKIKX0DER&musicTerritory=US&ref=dm_sh_zY05XPzhLhuow5dAgK3g2W9yC

TIMESTAMPS
06:10 Exploring Ascent Narratives and UFOs
08:37 Investigating Vatican Archives and Levitation
12:28 Comparing Historical and Modern Phenomena
21:40 Theresa of Avila's Angel Event
28:42 Synchronicities and Childhood Beliefs
29:39 Meeting Edward Carlos: An Experiencer's Story
31:10 The Process of Redaction
32:54 Historical Context and Space Programs
35:30 St. Francis of Assisi's Angel Experience
42:50 Q&A Session
53:15 Closing Remarks and Resources

Ep 6: Diana Walsh Pasulka on Levitation, Redaction, and the Ontological Shock of Contact

This week’s episode barely felt like work because this week I sat down with my dear friend, and one of my favorite people, Jay Christopher King. Jay is the cofounder and director of The Experiencer Group, a private online community dedicated to support, curiosity & community for people who’ve had anomalous events of all kinds. He is also the co-founder of the phenomenal Inquire Anomalous conference series in NYC along with James Iandoli.

NEW Class from Dr. James Madden
Unidentified Flying Hyperobject: UFOs, Philosophy, and the End of the World
Four-week online class via Zoom
Wednesdays, March 27 – April 24 (skips April 10), 2024
7 – 9 pm ET

Learn More About the Class
Sign Up Now

EPISODE BRIEF

BECOME A PATRON
Patrons get lots of great perks like early and ad-free episodes, access to the private The UFO Rabbit Hole Discord server, and twice-monthly Patron Zoom calls with Kelly Chase. Memberships start at just $5/month.

GET THE BOOK
Get a SIGNED COPY
Get it on Amazon

FOLLOW
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Facebook

MUSIC
Theme: Cabinet of Curiosities by Shaun Frearson

Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-ufo-rabbit-hole-podcast--5746035/support.

[The UFO Rabbit Hole] An Interview with Jay Christopher King: Experiencers & Disclosure

Lyssna när som helst, var som helst

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